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post #421 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by UltimateDisplay View Post
what does it do ?

From HDMI.org:


VRR lets a gaming source deliver video frames as fast as it can, which in many cases is slower than the normal static refresh rate. Graphics processors require different absolute periods to render each frame, and this time is dependent upon the complexity of the scene, the horsepower of the GPU, the resolution selected and the frame rate. When the GPU is taxed by the other three factors and does not finish rendering the next frame by the time it needs to be displayed, the source must either repeat the current frame or display the partially-rendered next frame, which causes judder and tearing. By waiting until the next frame is ready to transport it, a smoother gaming experience can be provided to the user.

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post #422 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by gorman42 View Post
Wow! Nvidia just managed to sway me from my Nvidia only ten years plus run on HTPC. Although I still don't know whether AMD cards are different (in supporting VRR through HDMI), so the point could be moot.
As mentioned above, VRR and eARC are two HDMI 2.1 specs that can be flashed to existing HDMI 2.0b chipsets, if the device mfr designed them to be flashed, thus making the HDMI chipset "HDMI 2.1".
I don't understand why you mentioned this to me. Either AMD supports VRR through HDMI or it doesn't. The fact that stuff is firmware upgradeable does not represent a guarantee.
One doesn't need to look further than Nvidia with VRR. It took them years. 😞

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post #423 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted by gorman42 View Post
I don't understand why you mentioned this to me. Either AMD supports VRR through HDMI or it doesn't. The fact that stuff is firmware upgradeable does not represent a guarantee.
One doesn't need to look further than Nvidia with VRR. It took them years. 😞
It was just an FYI, mostly for folks who may come across the post and are confused. Part of the smoke and mirrors that is going to be HDMI 2.1 is eARC and VRR. If the chipsets (HDMI 2.0b) have been designed to accommodate eARC and VRR, they can be firmware updated for those two options under the HDMI 2.1 protocol set. That way the device mfr can state that they have updated the existing chipsets to HDMI 2.1, which is technically accurate. For gamers, it's a great option because they can take advantage of those options without any hardware upgrades and possibly High Speed HDMI cable upgrade as well. It's mostly marketing imo opinion but if you already have that capability, that's great.
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post #424 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 02:01 PM
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I noticed something in the 12:48 minute Neil Robinson video posted by Value Electronics.

At time code 6:05 the menu shown breaks 'Smooth Gradation' out from 'MPEG Noise Reduction' for that 2019 spec set.

Looks like they implemented something we asked for on the 2018s. Too bad my C8 won't get it.

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post #425 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 02:21 PM
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Interesting new feature they are adding to 2019 OLEDs that allow you to change white boost to make picture brighter in SDR and HDR modes in the picture mode menus. What was once hidden in the SM is now in picture menu. It is something we can do to our current tv's too. If you want to increase white boost for SDR to give it same peak brightness of HDR, you go into SM and change HDR Module from normal to on. You can then calibrate your SDR mode to take into account the white boost. They also show in the video, that you can lower white boost for HDR by setting it to off in picture menu. Same can be done in SM by setting HDR module to off. Start at 6:10.


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post #426 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by sdf777 View Post
Thanks. I had a 65" B6 at my summer in Maine that I gave away last October because the judder/artifacts were so bad. The C7 in my winter home is much better. I'm looking for a C9 to be available before my return in mid-April or else I be using the 27" the grand kids use for games. Were the C8's available in late March?
March / April will be when they come out..... You should be ok

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Originally Posted by guitarguy316 View Post
My guess is still $3500 msrp on C8 65” only because they can take price up for hdmi 2.1
It's not about that, its about what a top end 65" is worth and there is a point to where the high end units are not worth making, hence no high end 42" or 50" are bing made.

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Originally Posted by helvetica bold View Post
I asked John Archer how the C9 compares to the New Panasonic. John mentioned again that this years model is brighter an 2018. Further proof of some panel revision. Looking forward to my C9 in March hopefully!
http://twitter.com/bigjohnnyarcher/...258093057?s=21
Does it really matter? Since OLED came out Panasonic has not released a USA model
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post #427 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post
March / April will be when they come out..... You should be ok

It's not about that, its about what a top end 65" is worth and there is a point to where the high end units are not worth making, hence no high end 42" or 50" are bing made.

Does it really matter? Since OLED came out Panasonic has not released a USA model


I was just curious how bright the 2019 models will get. Since they both use the same panel and Panasonic has some cooling tech I am curious if there’s a difference.


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post #428 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
It was just an FYI, mostly for folks who may come across the post and are confused.
Yeah, sorry. Re-reading myself I probably sounded confrontational, while I was actually genuinely curious about maybe missing something.

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post #429 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by olqxqipz View Post
VRR can be implemented on existing HDMI 2.0 hardware. AMD GPUs can currently use FreeSync over HDMI on a lot of monitors and samsung TVs.

Here is AMD's monitor list (filter it to HDMI)
http://www.amd.com/en/products/freesync-monitors
This is a great resource I wasn't aware of. Thanks so much for sharing.

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post #430 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post
While I am definitely not a fan of John Archer (Samsung fanboy IMO), Vincent isn't perfect either. I believe he put up a video a few months ago saying under no certain terms that HDMI 2.1 was not coming this year, and we all know how that prediction turned out. I've got both displays in my home and the C8 is better for motion, but I not going to dump my B7 either. The review done by AVForums went into detail about the motion improvement on the C8, and there are others. Pick your review(er)
I like to think most of us can differentiate between someone giving a prediction on the timing of HDMI 2.1 and the claims John Archer made with his evaluation of a sample on a showroom floor.

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post #431 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by gorman42 View Post
Yeah, sorry. Re-reading myself I probably sounded confrontational, while I was actually genuinely curious about maybe missing something.
Not a problem .

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post #432 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by venus933 View Post
I like to think most of us can differentiate between someone giving a prediction on the timing of HDMI 2.1 and the claims John Archer made with his evaluation of a sample on a showroom floor.
We give Vincent a pass on something he was wrong on while a certain forum member who isn’t in the business like Vincent nails 2.1 and LG. I like Vincent, but he’s not without flaws and I won’t say what U.S. located expert feels that way, but I trust what he says much more then the guy from the UK.

I hope Archer is right, I might dump the B7 if the 9s are that good. That doesn’t mean I’m holding my breath though. Picture would have to be much better, I don’t care about 2.1.

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post #433 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post
We give Vincent a pass on something he was wrong on while a certain forum member who isn’t in the business like Vincent nails 2.1 and LG. I like Vincent, but he’s not without flaws and I won’t say what U.S. located expert feels that way, but I trust what he says much more then the guy from the UK.

I hope Archer is right, I might dump the B7 if the 9s are that good. That doesn’t mean I’m holding my breath though. Picture would have to be much better, I don’t care about 2.1.
You're criticizing someone because he can't predict the future?? BTW pretty much the entire tech press agreed with that prediction. Yes a forum member correctly predicted it. Good on him. I'm sure he's made other predictions that were wrong. And he also seems like someone who dedicates far more time to learning the inner workings of LG than any professional reviewer.


No one is without flaws. And BTW if Vincent is also making some grand conclusions about how much better TVs looked at a CES showroom I would call it BS too.
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post #434 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 09:08 PM
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Of course the 9 series is going to have a better picture than the 8 series... that's how it works...

Anyone who says otherwise is just kidding themselves - or trying to justify their 8/7 series purchase.

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post #435 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 09:10 PM
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Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post
We give Vincent a pass on something he was wrong on...
This is nonsense. Not only was his expectation on HDMI 2.1 in line with the common wisdom but it has absolutely nothing to do with quality of TV reviews.
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post #436 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 09:38 PM
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Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post
We give Vincent a pass on something he was wrong on while a certain forum member who isn’t in the business like Vincent nails 2.1 and LG. I like Vincent, but he’s not without flaws and I won’t say what U.S. located expert feels that way, but I trust what he says much more then the guy from the UK.

I hope Archer is right, I might dump the B7 if the 9s are that good. That doesn’t mean I’m holding my breath though. Picture would have to be much better, I don’t care about 2.1.
Yes, Vincent isn't flawless but disparaging him on the grounds of not getting a prediction right and now bringing up some anonymous expert is hogwash.
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post #437 of 500 Old 01-11-2019, 10:17 PM
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2019 LG OLED Release Specifics

I haven’t followed the past history for timelines of LG’s new OLED lineups. When have they typically announced official release dates and prices after CES? Thank you so very much!
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post #438 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 02:42 AM
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I just realized something, this C9 has everything except a 12 bit panel. When will manufacturers release those?
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post #439 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 05:09 AM
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C9 8k ?

I am in the market for a new OLED 65”. Looks like March 2019 may be a good time to upgrade my 4 year old 65” 4K Vizio. I am strongly cosidering the LG C9 but am a bit confused by all the speculation about it’s release. Maybe the C8 will be deeply discounted and will be the better value. However, I am leaning away from purchasing the C8 and more towards the C9 as I do not want to upgrade again for another 4-5 years.

Does anyone know for sure that the C9 be a 8k panel? When can the conusmer reasonably expect to see any 8K content ?
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post #440 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 05:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes250R View Post
I am in the market for a new OLED 65”. Looks like March 2019 may be a good time to upgrade my 4 year old 65” 4K Vizio. I am strongly cosidering the LG C9 but am a bit confused by all the speculation about it’s release. Maybe the C8 will be deeply discounted and will be the better value. However, I am leaning away from purchasing the C8 and more towards the C9 as I do not want to upgrade again for another 4-5 years.

Does anyone know for sure that the C9 be a 8k panel? When can the conusmer reasonably expect to see any 8K content ?
c9 is a 9k panel now? i thought that was the z series?
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post #441 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 06:41 AM
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The C9 is 4k. The Z9 is 8k.
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post #442 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by MeganElisabeth View Post
I haven’t followed the past history for timelines of LG’s new OLED lineups. When have they typically announced official release dates and prices after CES? Thank you so very much!
Looks like it was March 5th, 2018 for the previous models last year. Here is an example article:

http://www.theverge.com/circuitbrea...g-release-date
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post #443 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 08:12 AM
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Any mention of improved color volume on the C9? According to Rtings the A9F has 10% greater color volume thanks to the Pixel Contrast Booster. Might not seem like much but I noticed greater color saturation at higher peak brightness when I demoed The A9 for gaming.


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post #444 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by helvetica bold View Post
Any mention of improved color volume on the C9? According to Rtings the A9F has 10% greater color volume thanks to the Pixel Contrast Booster. Might not seem like much but I noticed greater color saturation at higher peak brightness when I demoed The A9 for gaming.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarc.../#169d969d432d

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post #445 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Mikes250R View Post
I am in the market for a new OLED 65”. Looks like March 2019 may be a good time to upgrade my 4 year old 65” 4K Vizio. I am strongly cosidering the LG C9 but am a bit confused by all the speculation about it’s release. Maybe the C8 will be deeply discounted and will be the better value. However, I am leaning away from purchasing the C8 and more towards the C9 as I do not want to upgrade again for another 4-5 years.

Does anyone know for sure that the C9 be a 8k panel? When can the conusmer reasonably expect to see any 8K content ?
As mentioned earlier the C9 will be a 4K panel and at 65" that's plenty unless you do your viewing with your noise to the screen. JMO but to the extent 8K has any benefit would be for 80" plus screen sizes and you would want it dedicated to only pristine content. i.e. your cable/OTA and other bit starved content should be watched on an alternative smaller 4K display. Also, 4K blu rays may be the last physical source of content so I'm not sure how this 8K content gets delivered unless we go back to the early days of streaming where a buffer is built up before playback.

I would give some time to see how the C9 is evaluated by calibrators and reviewers. More often than not some of the promise and glitter of the CES evaporates with the reality of televisions from the store. Historically with LG OLED televisions improvements are more evolutionary than revolution. The revolutionary change likely happens with the next generation panel. But having said that like you I would prefer the newest model and damn the value proposition.

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post #446 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by helvetica bold View Post
Any mention of improved color volume on the C9? According to Rtings the A9F has 10% greater color volume thanks to the Pixel Contrast Booster. Might not seem like much but I noticed greater color saturation at higher peak brightness when I demoed The A9 for gaming.


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LG seems to have bee sticking to their 2018 ABL spevificatiions but pushing use of the colored subpixels without any contribution ftom the white subpixel all the way to 300cd/m2 in order to increasecolor volume.

Compared to the ABL chart they published fpr the 2017 WOLEDs (attached), they ate stickimg tp the improved 2018 ABL limits of:

Full field peak of 150cd/m2 (up from 130cd/m2 in 2017)
25% screen peak of 500cd/m2 (up from ~375cd/m2 in 2017)
10% screen peak of 800cd/m2 (up from 720cd/m2 in 2017)

The 2017 ABL curve limited HDR brightness to of 900cd/m2 for hoghlights of 3% or less and rtings.com measured a 2% window at 979cd/m2 (915cd/m2 sustained) so it appears that LG has continued relaxing the ABL limit for exev smaller areas of the screen.

2% is still a pretty large highlight (over 30"^2 on a 65" screen) so it would be great if Rtings.com would also characterize peak brightness at 1%, 0.5%, 0.25%, and even 0.1% (still ~1.6"^2) since it appears that LG may be delivering even higher peak brightness for HDR hoghlights without boasting about it...
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post #447 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post
While I am definitely not a fan of John Archer (Samsung fanboy IMO), Vincent isn't perfect either. I believe he put up a video a few months ago saying under no certain terms that HDMI 2.1 was not coming this year, and we all know how that prediction turned out. I've got both displays in my home and the C8 is better for motion, but I not going to dump my B7 either. The review done by AVForums went into detail about the motion improvement on the C8, and there are others. Pick your review(er)
I am curious what you mean by better motion. Do you mean TruMotion / motion interpolation is better (less SOE or artifacts) on the C8 as compared to the B7?
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post #448 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes250R View Post
I am in the market for a new OLED 65”. Looks like March 2019 may be a good time to upgrade my 4 year old 65” 4K Vizio. I am strongly cosidering the LG C9 but am a bit confused by all the speculation about it’s release. Maybe the C8 will be deeply discounted and will be the better value. However, I am leaning away from purchasing the C8 and more towards the C9 as I do not want to upgrade again for another 4-5 years.

Does anyone know for sure that the C9 be a 8k panel? When can the conusmer reasonably expect to see any 8K content ?
As others have mentioned the C9 will be a 4K panel not 8K. As for 8K content, your guess is as good as anyone's, there isn't any and won't be any time soon. Everything will be upscaled until real 8K comes.

Media room- 65" Panasonic FZ950 OLED, Pioneer Elite VSX-90, Panasonic UBD-820 4K, Klipsch Gallery G28's, Klipsch Sub 12, Klipsch RS-52 II, Optik HD cable

Living room- Sony 4K 79XBRX900B, Onkyo RC-360,HTPC,Klipsch Reference R-62II,Rc52II,PS4
Gaming room -Panasonic ST60, PS3, Wii
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post #449 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 12:31 PM
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Are we fairly confident that both LG and Sony will have 8K, HDMI 2.1, top emission OLED at larger sizes (75 inch and up) for next year at this time?
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post #450 of 500 Old 01-12-2019, 12:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by circumstances View Post
Are we fairly confident that both LG and Sony will have 8K, HDMI 2.1, top emission OLED at larger sizes (75 inch and up) for next year at this time?
HDMI2.1 on 2020 LGE WOLED, Yes (they already have it this year).

HDMI2.1 on 2020 Sony WOLEDs, Probably (unless they are incompetent or unlucky).

LGE 8K WOLEDs with Top Emission in 2020, Yes (at least 65" which they demoed at CES in their private booth).

Sony 8K WOLEDs with Too Emission in 2020, Probably (at least 65", possibly as early as late this year).

LGE 75/77" 8K WOLED with Top Emission in 2020, Likely (since 88" and 65" without 75/77" would be weird).

Sony 75/77" 8K WOLED with Top Emission in 2020, seems pretty likely if they are launching a 65" 8K...

LGE 2020 88" 8K WOLED moving to Top Emission, Maybe. Yes if they aim at 120Hz in 2020, but if they don't, who knows?
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